While thousands of new cannabis products hit the market each year, most fail to create product-market fit due to a lack of differentiation or clear-cut benefits.
Today’s guest is CEO of Dosist Gunner Winston, who has simplified cannabis consumption with targeted formulas and precise dosing to create a product that is catapulting cannabis into the wellness arena.
Learn more at https://dosist.com
- Gunner’s background in cannabis and how he came to start Dosist
- An inside look at Dosist and its mission to simplify cannabis consumption with innovative delivery devices
- How taking the guesswork out of cannabis is attracting more people to the category
- Variables that are important to luxury brand consumers
- Customer reactions to Dosist’s new dose pen and dose dial
- The thought process behind Dosist’s high-end yet minimalist retail environment
- Why Gunner believes brick and mortar stores remain valuable in the age of online shopping
- Where Dosist is in the capital-raising process
- How Gunner is planning to evolve Dosist in the coming years as consumer preferences change
Matthew: Hi, I'm Matthew Kind. Every Monday, look for a fresh new episode where I'll take you behind the scenes and interview the insiders that are shaping the rapidly evolving cannabis industry. Learn more at cannainsider.com. That's cannainsider.com. Now, here's your program.
Thousands of new cannabis products hit the market each year, but most fail to create product/market fit because they can't communicate the benefit or differentiation of the product to their prospective customers. Today's guest has simplified cannabis consumption and netted everything out to simplicity and clear benefits with his brand. I'm pleased to welcome Gunner Winston, CEO of dosist to the show. Gunner, welcome to "CannaInsider."
Gunner: Thanks for having me, Matthew.
Matthew: Give us a sense of geography. Where are you in the world today?
Gunner: Right now, I'm at our global headquarters on the iconic Abbot Kinney Street in Venice, California.
Matthew: Okay. That's becoming, what do they call it, Silicon Beach now, that area?
Gunner: Close. That's in the area and I'm looking at the wonderful sun and pretty warm weather right now, so not a bad seat.
Matthew: Great. And what is dosist on a high level for people that aren't familiar? I know most people in California for sure are, but give us a little background on the brand.
Gunner: Yeah, sure. dosist is a leading global wellness company that is on a mission to empower people to naturally manage their health and happiness. We do this through, really, two primary ways. It's our award-winning devices and our target formulations. And so when we talk about formulations, unlike traditional cannabis companies that think around strain names oftentimes, OG Kush or Durban Poison, or a variety of different strain names, we focus on the need states to which people often use cannabis to help with. So we have six different formulations, bliss, calm, sleep, relief, arouse and passion. And we have two award-winning delivery devices in our dose pen and now the dose dial, which houses our dissolvable tablet.
Matthew: Okay. And Gunner, can you share a little bit about your background and journey and how you got into the cannabis space and became CEO?
Gunner: Sure, Matthew. So unlike a lot of people in leadership positions in cannabis, I actually did not have a history with cannabis before joining dosist. I spent my entire career, professional career investing as a professional investor. Right out of college, I worked at Morgan Stanley and investment banking and then went to work at a large hedge fund and then co-founded my own hedge fund in 2007 to 2014. I retired from that space in 2014 largely because, and you can't see me now. I have a scruffy beard that just really didn't work on Wall Street. But really, it was a chance for me to explore other opportunities.
And when I came across cannabis as an investor, personal investor in 2016, I was fascinated by the category, but really what motivated me about dosist's narrative and when I met them, the narrative was less around intoxication and recreation and was far more focused on science and innovation and a true narrative of wellness and how to use cannabis to help people as opposed to just getting stoned.
Matthew: Okay. That makes a lot of sense. And what do you think about the transition from New York City hedge fund and then to, you know, Silicon Beach area where you are now? What's the culture difference? How do you feel about it?
Gunner: Yeah, exactly. It would look very different if you can imagine, you know, besides the fact that I'm able to wear, you know, sneakers and jeans every day, you know, clearly the LA versus New York dynamic's different. Including just the emerging space in which we're operating in, be it wellness or cannabis or both, right? It's such a progressive industry or industries, right, when you're thinking about cannabis and wellness, that it's really a wonderful platform to explore and think about so many creative and innovative ways to address health and happiness. You know, I think the difference in sometimes for New York and finance in particular, it's more regimented, more structured. The expectations have been set.
One of the beauties of the cannabis space, including what dosist is doing, is we are changing many of the codes and stereotypes that have existed for decades as related to cannabis usage. And that's really exciting for me. And I think LA, honestly, and California broadly is at the forefront of so many changes in the world, particularly as it relates to wellness, whether it was yoga or the way you eat and healthy diets. A lot of it starts out here so it's really exciting to have, having had launched this brand, dosist, in California
Matthew: At a high level, do you see the cannabis market as a whole... When you look at it, the flower will always be there, but people seem to be reaching for more innovative solutions and, as you talked about, kind of dialing in specific benefits, like you're kind of pairing a solution to a perceived problem, you know, with bliss or passion. How do you think the market as a whole is kind of moving and where do you see it kind of going around the corner next?
Gunner: Yeah, I think when people have historically talked about cannabis, it was from such a myopic view, right? It was someone in often a, you know, two guys sitting on a couch, I often say, eating Doritos, watching "Wayne's World," and particularly high, right? And what we've realized, and other brands, is that there is a world of people out there who are either scared of cannabis, who are against cannabis usage, but at the same time are either taking prescription pills or drinking heavily and don't even really understand why they don't like cannabis. And there are a variety of reasons, as we've explored it, for that. Some that you just can't fight, right? The government, the broader society, not just in the US, but globally has demonized cannabis usage, has associated obviously cannabis usage with a lack of productivity when we obviously know and most people who are fans of the cannabis plant understand that it can be uplifting and empowering.
The challenge sometimes is around the delivery mechanisms. So not just seeing a flower, which unfortunately has been connected to all of the ills of cannabis usage. And I'm not saying appropriately, but those are the facts, to also the ability to control that product. So someone gives you a bong or a joint. For most new consumers, it's extremely intimidating. And so what dosist has brought to the category really is science innovation. And part of that is taking the guesswork out of the cannabis, out of cannabis usage. So by that, I mean if someone passes you a joint, Matthew, the first question normally is where did it come from, what's in it and how much do I take? And so what we have worked on is we do know most people are coming to cannabis, whether they're high potency users or a new user for a reason, or they might wanna feel blissful, they might wanna deal with anxiety, they might wanna deal with sleep issues or pain issues.
The challenge when you have flower is creating that repeatability of the experience. As we think about a brand, a brand has to mean something and there's the repetition of that narrative. And so when you go to...when you go to New York and get a, you know, a Big Mac, it's normally gonna be the same as when you go to California and the same, whether it's Corona beer or whatever traditional consumer product, consumable product. The challenge with flower, as you know, is the growing conditions can be very challenging even when it's in the same location.
So what we've brought to the table using our formulations, so targeted formulas that are using different cannabinoids and botanical terpenes as well as our delivery devices where we've taken the guesswork out of the usage because we deliver the same amount every single time. It's allowing people to explore the category who maybe would have never considered cannabis before. And then we add a lot of design to that, right? So our devices are obviously medically forward in their presentation, and we're using medical grade materials, obviously have been gone with white products to connote sort of a more medical sense. All of these things help bring people into the category and make it a little less taboo.
Matthew: Okay. When people compare commodities, they usually compare by price. With a luxury brand, price is always there, but it's not as important. You know, you mentioned a little bit about consistency with a brand, but is there anything other than price and consistency that are variables that are important to luxury brand shoppers?
Gunner: Yeah. And I think, you know, Matthew, when we think about representing dosist, we actually eschew the word "luxury" and favor more "aspirational" because "luxury" immediately connotates separating a certain segment of the market, right? Saying you're only gonna appeal to people who have a certain amount of money. You know, we have a variety of different products at different price points. We do sell a premium product, but premium doesn't just mean price. Premium is the experience. Premium is the innovation. Premium is the experience outside of just the product, right? It can be in, you know, whether it's a shopping shop that we might create in a store, whether it's creating our own stores. My only point to you is when I think about the greatest brands, you know, from Nike to Apple to Starbucks, think about consumer brands, innovation is often at the forefront of what they do. Just the way you stay ahead to ensure that pricing isn't the only way that you can beat. Because to your point, when I think about a commodity, the essence of a commodity is it's somewhat fungible, right? It moves around, people are not purchasing it for any other reason than that it's the cheapest. Whereas we think about investing in the brand and investing in innovation, so quality becomes important, right?
Ensuring that, whether it's our dose control pen or a dose style, that we're representing the product appropriately. We explain to people what's in it, what's not in it. So safety is one component. Broader innovation, right? Making sure we don't stand still. Our dose pen, which has won many awards, came out in 2016. We have our next generation of dose pens coming out in Q1 of this year, sorry, 2020, but we also have other dose control products because we have to innovate and stay ahead. So my only point is when I look and really compartmentalize what separates a commodity from a brand, it's really that investment in the brand and that investment has to be around innovation and experiences and safety and trust.
Matthew: Yeah. Now one of the problems you're solving with dosist is obviously the dosing piece. This is nontrivial and keeps many potential new customers away. In fact, I have a lot of people I know that it keeps them away. And existing cannabis consumers that accidentally overconsumed, you know, they kind of shy away, too, because they had a bad experience. What's the reaction you get from people that are kind of in the, the kind of cannabis-shy or had a bad experience and you give them the dosist pen, what's kind of the initial reaction? What do they come back to you and say consistently?
Gunner: I think the key word and reaction I get is one of empowerment that they now know that cannabis isn't maybe as dangerous as people have referenced, right? It was always the common assumption that if you try cannabis, you're gonna become a stoner. If you try cannabis, it's gonna be a gateway as opposed to how to make cannabis part of your life to elevate you, right? So we look at our brand very much as a performance brand. When you sleep better, you perform better. When you have less anxiety, you perform better. When you're able to find calm or bliss, you perform better. When you're able to mitigate your pain, you perform better.
And so to your point, when people use our products, they first realize that, "Wow, using THC is not always going to get me overly intoxicated," right? We know there are the explicit elements of intoxication that come from THC, but when you dose control it, right, combined with having the same repeatable formulations every single time, you're able to step into a brand and not have the unanticipated outcomes that often came with cannabis usage. So that's really important and it's been really, I think, changed people's expectations of cannabis products and we're really happy to be a part of that.
Matthew: Curious, which of the pens sell the best?
Gunner: Sure. So of our six formulations, bliss and calm are our bestsellers in California. And part of that reason is really because I think, one, bliss is the more THC-forward product. It's one of our, we had the core four originally, which was bliss, calm, sleep, and relief. passion, arouse came out a little after. And then calm is our more CBD-forward product. So between those two, I think you really have a healthy mix of some people looking for a little less THC, right? Which you can get in our calm product, which is heavily skewed to CBD, a 10 to 1 CBD to THC ratio, and our bliss, which is an 8 to 1 THC to CBD ratio kind of gives you, as we say, the right amount of good.
Matthew: Right. Right. I haven't been in your retail stores yet, but from what I see, they look really polished, minimalist, high-end or aspirational.
Gunner: Thank you.
Matthew: What's the thought process when creating a retail environment?
Gunner: Yeah, for us, Matthew, it was really less about economics and it was more about three things. It was, number one, to inspire, right? We wanna have a brand, if you're gonna be aspirational, you have to have people inspired by your brand. We wanna make sure that we educate. So the challenge of any brand is you walk into a wholesale channel, are they gonna represent you correctly? Right? If you throw us in the backhand corner near the bathroom on the third bottom shelf, right, you're not gonna see us. You're not gonna understand what dosist is about. And the last is to engage. By that, I mean we have really, really wonderful guides. Those are our sales associates in our stores who aren't paid on commission. And their job is to engage you and if you choose to purchase that day, it's your choice.
Most importantly, we want you to leave having had a good experience because if you tell 10 people about having a wonderful dosist wellness experience, which is what we call our stores, that's more valuable oftentimes than you buying one or two products from us that day. And so really, those are the three fundamental elements of our stores. So everything you see should feel like the visual representation of our brand and our products, right? Our store, our products are very, as you said, polished, minimalist, and aspirational, and so is our store. But those hallmarks that I just referenced are what are key to us when you engage with us.
Matthew: Okay. So, dosist came on my radar because I've heard you were doing so well on the LeafLink platform, that is, a lot of the retail dispensaries were, you know, want your product. So if one reaches out to you, it's not just like, "Hey, I wanna sell dosist pens." They have to show, like, a willingness to have it in a, kind of a certain position in the retail environment?
Gunner: Yes. So when started, I took over the company in May 2017 as CEO. The company launched September 2016. And when I came in, we were in 250 stores in California. Within two months, after surveying the landscape, visiting a large portion of our stores, we cut 40% of the store base from 250 stores to about 150 stores within two months because we wanted to make sure, and this is important for any brand, you properly align your brand positioning and presence with the ultimate retail experience.
And so I always say there's a reason Chanel doesn't sell in Macy's and Kohl's. It's because they're going to demolish the integrity of the Chanel brand, whether it's price discounts, whether it's not putting them in good visual merchandising locations, whether it's having, you know, inappropriate education on the products. And so all those things we look at in a similar light for dosist.
And so when you go into an account and it's only focused on potency and getting people really high, you might not be a fan of dosist and we're okay with that. But when we do partner with you, we truly partner, you know, and what we ask for is prominent visual merchandising so we can educate appropriately on what we're doing and then being able to educate the sales associates because we do sell a premium product that is often or sometimes more expensive than other products because we're investing so much in our quality and our safety that we need someone to be able to explain why you might want to pay more for something and all the things that we're doing to protect the consumers.
So my point is when we get those two things, Matthew, we then work really hard with them to help drive people to those stores, so between co-marketing and education outside of the four walls to help them drive in. But you're right. We very much curate the number of stores we're selling into really so we can find alignment. I'd happily sell in 300 stores in California. We just haven't found 300 good partners.
Matthew: Okay. Gunner, I have this feeling with the ease of online delivery of cannabis products that retail experience is really going to have to be so special, tactile and visually stunning. Otherwise, well, people will just eventually order everything from their phone. Do you feel like that's where we're going, and how do you deal with that?
Gunner: Yeah, I think to your initial comment about the direction of where the cannabis industry might go, I think it's somewhat analogous to where retail in general is going, right? If you don't have a credible experience, to your point, retail is very challenging. That's happening across the board from obviously book sales to purchasing luggage to wherever else, right? The convenience is key. But that being said, right, even digitally-native brands are realizing that retail is still a very viable methodology of reaching consumers, of educating consumers, and e-commerce on its own is not the end-all, be-all.
With that being said, I think the keys for me are going to always be location, right, for retail, and then, to your point, experience. And I think the retailers that are winning are combining those two, making sure you're in well-trafficked areas and simultaneously offering the consumers a reason to drive often in traffic, get out of their car, find parking, pay for, you know, maybe a meter and then go into your store. So I think it's gonna continue to force retailers to get better. We certainly understand that. You know, we look at where a lot of our consumers are going, they don't wanna be inconvenienced. And I think as this industry evolves like every other industry for consumer products, you're right, it's gonna put more pressure on retailers to continue to elevate that and not take for granted that the consumer has choices.
So for us, you know, we continue to look at reaching our consumer as the ultimate decision making point. But the challenge of online is education, right? When you have the online experience, the piece that is difficult to bridge from the store to online is how do I communicate with a new or existing consumer, right? So if you know you already like dosist, well, it's no problem to reorder, but what happens when we bring out new products, right? And there's education around that. And certainly for the new consumer, I think we have still years and maybe decades of introduction to the category where retail really can be fundamental to cushioning someone's introduction to cannabis.
Matthew: Yeah, it's good points there. You know, you mentioned that, you know, adding new products. How do you decide which products to greenlight? Is that based on feedback from existing customers? Because sometimes customers say they want something and then they, it's different than what they said. And, you know, sometimes they wanna be surprised or they want something totally new or they have higher expectations of your brand and they don't want a "me too" product. Like for example, I think of like Apple's new, you know, TV, it's like people that have Apple products like it, but they weren't necessarily looking for, like, Netflix from Apple. They wanted something that's, like, exceeds their expectations. So how do you look at which projects to greenlight?
Gunner: Yeah, perfect. I think that's a great question. And for us, Matthew, it starts with our mission. Our mission is to empower people to naturally manage their health and happiness. Now, we first have done that through cannabinoids, right? THC, CBD and other cannabinoids. We first did that through our dose pen, our award-winning dosing device. What's important, though, as we think about future innovation is, number one, you have to innovate to continue to stay relevant, especially in a competitive category. I always say, could you imagine if Nike only had their 1975 Nikes today and never came out with Nike Airs? If Apple only had the iPhone 1, I think they're on the iPhone 11 now. My point is innovation is so fundamental to any developing business because once you find success, people try to find ways to knock you off. And the best solution to competition is to have someone chase a moving target.
But what's just important in this space is also knowing what you shouldn't do. So if our brand is to empower people to naturally manage their health and happiness, and we do that through two main verticals of targeted formulations and dose control products, what don't we do is where we often start. So we don't do flour and we don't do pre-roll because the repeatability of those products is really challenging combined with having a wellness narrative, right? When people are taking either, you know, bong hits or smoking a joint, we have no problem with that, but it's really hard to stick to our brand ethos.
And then you focus on what can you do. And so long as it fits sort of the two parameters of targeted formulations and dose control, we'll consider it. So, an edible, certainly dose controlled. Can we do targeted formulations? Those are decisions we make. A topical, you know, potentially a spray, things like that, Matthew, come into the equation and then it's about, can dosist offer the consumer something that doesn't exist today? So it took us 18 months to bring out our second product, which is the dose dial, the dose dial is the first certified child-resistant packaging or, rather, device for our dissolvable tablet, a 3.7 milligram, low-dose dissolvable tablet. And the reason it took so long is because we were trying to do something different than another mint or a gummy that's in an Altoids-type container.
When we think about the fundamental challenge for the edible category, it's whether it's your kids or adults taking a product that they didn't know was THC-infused. And so anyway, my point of all that is as we think about innovation, it has to fit our guardrails of precise dose formulation. And then we have to bring something different to the category. If we can't, we tend to just pass.
Matthew: That makes sense. Can I tell you my wishlist for dosist?
Gunner: Please, please.
Matthew: You know how there's these glucose monitors now that monitor blood sugar. I would love to have something like a smart patch and then something that integrates with my phone or like an Apple Watch that I can...it monitors, you know, my blood and I can kind of give, like nudge it where how I'm feeling a little bit. And then it says, "Okay, based on your, you know, your heartbeat and your blood and all these different variables, you know, this is what your smart patch can do." Like, it gives me 10% more calm or 10% more bliss. I mean, that's a little bit...that would require some R&D, but, and I don't know if people are gonna want that...
Gunner: No, fascinating.
Matthew: ...but I would love something like that.
Gunner: I think, Matthew, that's a great challenge for us.
Matthew: Yeah. Well, cool. Well, tell me, Gunner, where are you in the capital-raising process right now with dosist?
Gunner: Yeah, so we launched, as I said before, in September 2016. The capital-raising process, which was before me, started at sort of inception of the business in late 2015 and '16. And so we've had several different capital raises to this point in time. We don't disclose the exact amount, but for us, you know, we've tended to be pretty private as it relates to capital-raising because you see a lot of times companies have these splashy headlines when they raise money. When you get to see one from us, you know, the key for us is continuing to raise the right amount of money that allows us to fund the business on its path to growth and also becoming self-funding, which is a key dynamic in this business or any business, right, is how do you transition to be dependent on outside funding to funding yourself. And that's a journey that we're obviously on as well as we look to move into a lot of new categories and new geographies. But what I can tell you is we fully balance the opportunity, which is big, versus the need to be financial responsible along the way.
Matthew: Okay. If there's accredited investors listening that are interested in investing, is that an opportunity or no?
Gunner: You know, I think, for us, we've been very fortunate to have a fairly dynamic group of investors where we haven't had to do a lot of outside fundraising. But, you know, I think, as always, you're always looking for the right investors, Matthew. It's less to me about money or the absolute number of investors. It's about finding people who understand the vision and simultaneously understand what we're trying to build, which takes time. And so to your point, I think for anyone, you know, once again, they can reach out to us on our website or through customer service. If there's always an interest, we're always looking for, more so than the exact amount of money or the pedigree of the person. It's finding the person who understands the vision of where we're going.
Matthew: Okay. So if you're going to identify yourself as an accredited investor, say why you think you're a good fit beyond just money.
Matthew: Okay. Okay. And I wanna ask a couple personal development questions, Gunner. Is there a book that's had a big impact on your life or your way of thinking that you'd like to share?
Gunner: Oh, good question. So there are a couple but one sticks out to me that I read maybe 10-plus years ago. It was called, "Pour Your Heart Into It." It was written by Howard Schultz, the former CEO and chairman of Starbucks. And what was fascinating, it was less of a business book and more along the lines of the title about finding things in life that you're passionate about. And when you find passion and match your skillset with that particular endeavor, you're really positioned for success. And for me, like I'm a complete passion guy. Like people have asked me in the past about my ability to disconnect and everyone who kind of works with me knows that I'm normally always on, like anything that I see. If I see sort of a off-white image on a street and I might reach out to our CMO and go, "Hey, have we thought about, you know, changing the color of our pens to off-white?"
I'm making this up completely, but I just live in the world of what I'm doing at the time and, which is the reason I didn't work formally for three years. So I think that book is a reminder to me of, you know, you'll be most successful when you do things where you really do wanna pour your heart into it. And then the challenge for each individual is managing obviously what's going on in their life outside of work and their stress with that ambition. But I do think for me, "Pour Your Heart Into It" is fundamental to everything I do. Whether it's being a dad, whether it's working, whether it's being a husband, I think those are just really life lessons that extend beyond business.
Matthew: Oh, that's a great suggestion. I haven't heard that one yet. So what would you say is the most interesting thing going on in your field besides what you're doing at dosist?
Gunner: Yeah, sure. I think, you know, for me, what's fascinating about the field is as we, the industry develops from an illicit market to one that's heavily regulated, are all of the elements that go into creating not just a large and regulated business, but one that's sustainable. And the ability for businesses to develop and thrive, you know, so overregulation can stymie that, too little can lead to a lack of distrust from consumers and people outside of the space. And so for me, what I find continually fascinating is that unlike, or it's actually similar to most other spaces, you're going to have to invest in your quality and safety, especially as you have an ingestible product. Because irrespective of where the regulatory environment is, the best brands that I have come across particularly for consumable products are ones where consumers trust them, right? They trust that they're gonna adhere to standards that are oftentimes higher than what's required by the industry, right?
And as I look at what's going on, you have this sort of jigsaw puzzle of regulations that exist at the state level because of the lack of federal infrastructure. And to me, it's fascinating to see us developing as an industry, but simultaneously realizing that if you don't adhere to dynamic and appropriate regulation, one group of people is gonna lose and that's the consumer.
Matthew: Great points. Great points. What is one thought you have that most people would disagree with you on? That's a Peter Thiel question.
Gunner: You know, the biggest pushback I've had initially, and maybe a little less so now, has been my viewpoint on when you have a big space, most people view it as it's a gold rush and you almost treat it like real estate where you have to grab as much land as quickly as possible. We at dosist have taken a very, very divergent path is we recognize the opportunity.
We said this is not a land rush or a gold rush. It's a rush to get good. And so oftentimes, as you know, spreading yourself too thin is the enemy of getting good, right? It's the ability to kind of spread yourself out and hope someone buys you. And instead, dosist has treated this as if we're never going to sell. We've treated this as we're trying to create a forever brand and we invest far above where regulations are today and far above what our actual business can fully support because we're trying to build a brand that answers to one group of people and that is the consumer. And so that's been the challenge initially. I think people are now seeing scaling this space is really, really hard. And while people got out of the gates very quickly in this space, they're having to retrench now or they're going out of business. And so that has really been the biggest dynamic is big opportunity doesn't always mean rushing. You can't go slowly, but you have to service the customer first before you serve as anyone else.
Matthew: That's excellent strategy and it's obviously served you well.
Gunner: Thank you.
Matthew: Gunner, as we close, just a few questions to help listeners. Where are dosist products available right now if...for listeners that want to try one?
Gunner: Yeah. So right now we're available throughout the entire state of California. We're available in Nevada and Florida.
Matthew: Okay. And what states are...do you see yourself expanding to next that we should keep that a lookout for?
Gunner: This is really an exciting part of our journey. As I said before, we've really taken three years and a very pragmatic and measured approach to growth, but simultaneously looking at our long-term vision of becoming a global aspirational brand. And we've really put the infrastructure in place to now scale pretty aggressively.
We launch in Canada in six days, the first legalized international market for dosist. That's quite exciting. We'll be represented throughout the country in a fairly prominent way. Also in the first quarter, we'll be launching in Colorado and Arizona and targeting Michigan for the first half of 2020. So it's really exciting for us because we do believe through all these different geographies, we're learning how to scale and that most of these markets, unfortunately and fortunately, are like their own little countries. But as we're learning how to do them, the ability to scale is getting a little bit easier as we go forward.
Matthew: Sure. Well, Gunner, please give out your website so listeners can find you.
Gunner: Yeah, so www.dosist.com. And if anyone wants to get in touch, just click "Contact Us" in our bottom navigation of dosist.com and you can speak with us or email us.
Matthew: Great. Gunner, thanks so much for coming on the show. This has really been fun and you guys are really crushing it, so well done. Kudos to you.
Gunner: Thanks for the great questions, Matthew. I appreciate you having me.
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